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+--- Thread: 2013 BAJR Grades (/showthread.php?tid=4652)
2013 BAJR Grades - P Prentice - 13th November 2012
trowelfodder Wrote:What will naming and shaming really achieve? Who is really going to rise up and say oh my god that's terrible lets not use these archaeological units lets use locally sourced ethically produced labour. And when someone who needs a job needs a job will they say oh no i cant work for these people they are on a list! No those that will do it will do it.you appear to put the onus on those who have already been badly dealt. a league table might not move developer conscience in the short term but s**t will stick eventually
Name and shame - and what about the naming and shaming of those who are working for the low wages, those who are bringing pay and conditions down for the masses. Those that through lack of backbone are ruining any attempt at collective negotiation. SCABS
or are these people people with familes to support, broke graduates facing a horrendous job market, experienced diggers with no choice?
Is always easy to talk in the abstract but there are real people involved and real people are getting hurt. Think back to the strikes of the 1970's and 1980's although there was a lot of idealism that kept workers out there was also the community pressure that to go back would lead to social isolation and exclusion.
And will that happen here - or will as ever there will be shit loads of winging, everyone agrees something has to be done - you agitate for change and challange things, look around and the rest are staring at there shoes looking uncomfortable.
Maybe we are just too late - I just think back to the illfated BAJR conference in York. Almost no-one turned up. BAJR is self employed - he doesn't need to do this and we as a proffession need to stop relying so heavily on him to do the leg work, the negotiating etc and take responsibility.
I think that rather than naming and shaming we nail our coulors to the mast. Wouldnt a pledge which we sign up to be more producive? I so and so will not work for below ?xxx per week. Show you support the measure through action not just quietly mumbling yes more pay would be good, if you could just sort it out for me .............!
2013 BAJR Grades - Wax - 13th November 2012
Any league table would have to be factual rather than hear say (I seem to remember a unit league table on BAJR many moons ago where things got a bit messy). It is unrealistic to expect people who are desperate for work not to take up employment unless it is above a certain wage especially when the state benefits system will penalise you if you do not take up available employment.
I had a career once but it wasn't in archaeology and for all it's structure job security and decent wages it was mental hell. I don't have a career in archaeology but I am able to find work that i enjoy and that keeps me sane. For that I pay a price. For how much longer I am willing to pay that price I do not know.
It may be that we have to expect that the current system does not work with far too many people trying to enter a profession that has no structure and limited future prospects.
2013 BAJR Grades - trowelfodder - 14th November 2012
Its not unrealistic its about making archaeologists take some responsibility for themselves! We can not make ourselves the victim we have to come out and say enough is enough! We are hurting ourselves and each other by not engaging. If people work for shit wages then companies will pay shit wages. Change will only come when we stand together and say enough is enough. Unionisation attempts
has been met with a muted responce so choose your line
2013 BAJR Grades - kevin wooldridge - 14th November 2012
trowelfodder Wrote:Its not unrealistic its about making archaeologists take some responsibility for themselves! We can not make ourselves the victim we have to come out and say enough is enough! We are hurting ourselves and each other by not engaging. If people work for shit wages then companies will pay shit wages. Change will only come when we stand together and say enough is enough. Unionisation attempts has been met with a muted responce so choose your line
TF is absolutely right. We are not hapless victims here, much of the 'angst' in UK archaeology is as a result of self-abuse...er.....maybe I mean self-inflicted!!
Just seen on another 'channel' that Southampton City Council have announced the closure of their archaeology unit with the sad loss of 10 posts. Here is a perfect example of where other archaeologists could support SCC workers by refusing to take on work resulting from the closure. It would be heartening to see that happening, but I suspect the wolf (wolves) may already be at the door looking to pick up any scraps left behind...
2013 BAJR Grades - Bodger51 - 28th December 2012
I read through the consulation document on my travels and was taken aback by the no time frame element ascribed to the telescoping phase.
In the abscence of a time frame, it merely stands to bring an end to BAJR through a determined commitment.
Admittedly, the pay commitments is reliant upon the positions of the employing bodies, but the only thing holding this back is the character of either judgement or action being the services (and product) provided.
Judgement easier to deliver, but holds a self fulfilling condition to it.
I am however suprised by the makeup of the IfA, in numerical distribution terms.
I think we are still struggling over the supervisor conditioning factors, to be able to make clear distinctions on what judgement can be provided and delivered in the realtime of data collection
2013 BAJR Grades - BAJR - 28th December 2012
Thank you for reading it though...
Quote:In the absence of a time frame, it merely stands to bring an end to BAJR through a determined commitment.
Bringing BAJR to an end is certainly not the intention. but I am aware that you can't drag a horse to water it has to want to have a drink!
Timeframes are meant to be broken... as every other initiative seems to have been - BAJR has however evolved and created the basis for change. supporting or supported by others.
Would the phrase "over the next few years" be helpful
less than a decade more than 2 years.
this is not something to push. seeing as it seems that this would be BAJR led?