+- BAJR Federation Archaeology (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk)
+-- Forum: BAJR Federation Forums (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: The Site Hut (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Thread: Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger (/showthread.php?tid=3122)
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - vulpes - 25th May 2010
Quote:the IfA doesn't have a handy forum to ask questions on!
You could always try phoning them, it's always worked for me.
Quote:Why do they want to debase themselves
Now hang on, I'm not sure that anyone is debasing themselves.... other than maybe me for replying to this guff.
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - BAJR - 25th May 2010
lets try to remain on topic everyone. the question it there as to whether the ifa members should be consulted too and also whether it alters the status and represntation of illustrators and surveyors.. of which i am one.
i would like to see arguements for and against the motion.
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - chiz - 25th May 2010
Hi David, I saw this proposal in the last AAI&S newsletter and it had been gnawing away at the back of my mind, but I've been seriously busy and the voting/decision date was way off... so...
I'm a recently joined licentiate member of the AAI&S, have my portfolio ready for submission, but just haven't got round to biting the bullet and sending off to get the date for Assessment. Like you I will be not a little worried at the prospect of a peer-reviewed, no short-cuts, admission grilling, and once I do get time to arrange a submission then I will be bricking it until the Big Day arrives. This is, to me, how admission to such a grouping should be.
So is it any different to applying to be a similar grade at the IFA? Well as a fairly recent new MIFA I have to say that I felt exactly the same about my application to the ifa for MIFA as I currently do for the application to AAI&S! So it aint like applying to be Mifa (or whatever grade) is a soft option by comparison.
So why did I apply to join each of these organisations? Well the reasons for the application to iFA were a bit complex, but the application to join AAI&S was specifically in order to aim at being accepted as an MAAI&S. Not the newsletter, not the website, not the AGM. Purely to get them letters to support my work as a freelance illustrator. Selfish? Well maybe, but those who know me will know that I will always do what I can do help any group I am a member of. But as a freelance illustrator those letters, and the peer review that they involve, are what you need to demonstrate that you have what it takes and get that immediate ‘trust’ to expand your client base beyond word of mouth clients.
But what about the proposal to merge the two organisations? Well the AAI&S have been ‘twinned’ with the Illustrators SIG at the IFA for a while, and share interests and priorities, and probably (unpaid) committee members, but personally I see the two as having different but complementary roles. The AAI&S should continue as being a peer-reviewed group, with two tiers of membership, where full membership means you have passed a rigorous and SPECIFICALLY illustrator/survey based assessment. And to be honest the idea that the IFA has unlimited staffers to take over the running of any merged group is laughable, the SIGs are run by unpaid members, same as at the AAI&S. There will be little change in workload for committee members. Unless of course the unbelievable happens and more volunteers come forward.
I would say to Liz that I really don’t see why you can’t get to be accepted as MIFA as a specialist illustrator in the same way as any other type of specialist can? Have you checked with the IFA admissions group? I know at least one of them should be keen to get illustrator specialists up there. Maybe this is another possible route for this? Can anyone from Ifa comment?
Yes licentiate should maybe = Pifa (on receipt of proof of basic equivalent competence), and MAAI&S definitely =MIFA, but lets keep MAAI&S as well! It does MEAN something. Or as a MIFA can I get to be a MAAI&S just because I am in the Illustration SIG? Surely reciprocal rights! I fully understand the issues with running a small organisation, and the fact that it is tempting to merge, but lets not throw the baby out with the bath water?
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - RedEarth - 26th May 2010
vulpes Wrote:You could always try phoning them, it's always worked for me.
Now hang on, I'm not sure that anyone is debasing themselves.... other than maybe me for replying to this guff.
Thanks. And thanks for the positive feedback!
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - BAJR - 26th May 2010
And thanks Chiz for putting into words my own feelings
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - BAJR - 1st June 2010
Seems like there is growing disgruntlement about this merger.
I feel that there is a strong need for a strong identity... sure you can be a MIFA as well... for a while I was both MIFA and MAAIS (pricey though) and I got lots of relevant stuff and info for my membership of AAI&S I have yet to see a strong argument for merger. Perhaps I could be persuaded. would anyone care to offer a strong point of view?
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - trowelfodder - 3rd June 2010
I feel strongly that this is the wrong way to go - the two skill sets are simply not comparable
That is not to say that I think that one is more skilled or more important simply that to mesh the grades does not compare like with like
Whilst I recognise that there are numerous archaeologists who have more that one set of skills there are numerous others who dont. And an MAAI&S who had only done illustration for years - maybe dug early on in thier career but never rose above digger before moving to illustration - who was converted to MIFA would not be capable of carrying out site management at the same level. And to switch it around a MIFA would now put this qulification when carrying out illustration would not in the majority of cases produce work of the same standard as a MAAI&S.
Although I realise that this change in letter does not mean that illustrators will suddenly be taking on new roles or the other way round it does raise questions when job adverts are placed which ask for IFA membership at particular levels.
Show off what your good at, embrace diversity
*****(sorry Red Earth just reread yuor post and am restating some of your points)****
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - trowelfodder - 3rd June 2010
And there is the small matter of:
AAI&S Annual Subscription Rates
Full Membership* ?40.00 Assessment required
Licentiate ?40.00 Two references required
Licentiate (Graduate)** ?20.00 Two references required
Associate ?20.00 No voting rights, no references required
Concessionary ?20.00 unwaged and retired
Compared to:
Subscription rates for April 2010 – March 2011
rates ive given are for membership paying by cheque with a journal - there is a small reduction for paying by direct debit. Have not included journaless prices as there is a publication from the AAI&S
rates ive given are for membership paying by cheque with a journal - there is a small reduction for paying by direct debit. Have not included journaless prices as there is a publication from the AAI&S
[SIZE=2]? Affiliate subscription fee: [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?52.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?52.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Student subscription fee: [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?30.50 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?30.50 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]All corporate members (PIfAs, AIfAs, MIfAs)? pay according to annual income [/SIZE]
Salary band
Salary band
[SIZE=2]?5,000 - ?10,000 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?54.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?10,001 - ?15,055 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?81.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?15,056 - ?16,537 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?117.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?16,538 - ?20,000 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?155.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]?20,001 - ?28,000 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?197.00 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]More than ?28,001 = [/SIZE][SIZE=2]?226.00 [/SIZE]
Now ?40 a year I am prepared to pay ?155-197 i'm not! And how would IFA members feel about varying rates- tho i guess thats not going to happen
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - BAJR - 3rd June 2010
Have been sent this by an AAI&S member...
here is what he thinks
Quote:It's the assumption that illustration isn't really a specialism and that if you're MAAI&S only in the majority of cases would your work be better than anyone who fancied putting some drawings together. I know I couldn't manage a site but could a site manager manage a graphics office?
It's the "only an illustrator" an attitude I'm sick of coming across and being given briefs that blatantly show the report writer hasn't a clue how to use drawings from the field to interpret the site, or how to even make them legible.
I'm also sick of sorting out truly shocking fieldwork because some muppet has surveyed the site off a lampost, or picked up a site plan halfway through and not noticed they'd rotated it upside down so drawn the entire site back to front from the way the site outline and the first few features were drawn. I'm not bl**dy psychic but I know how to untangle the shambles that I get given and make it into a clear concise drawing that tells the story of the site - and generally save people's as*es.
Nice to be appreciated.... Just because you move into illustration doesn't mean you stop learning about archaeology and how commercial archaeology works, but there's the old them and us attitude that dogs the profession alive and well. (Phew that was a bit more of a rant than I expected - sorry!)
The AAI&S is not able to tackle this issue, and the only positive feedback I've discussed with other members is about finally getting some recognition that when you take on the management of graphics, which is where most MAAI&S have got to, you should be recognised as MIfA and that you have the relative archaeological knowledge as well as specialist ability/knowledge to be able to do so.
Now I too have been an illustrator and surveyor for many years... and get the attitude they describe... oh... just make up a couple of pics... blah blah... how hard is it.. etc... never get your hands dirty... why should you get a mention on the report... you 'only drew the illustrations' etc... I know quite a lot of illustrators, surveyors and draughtspeople who still dig (myself included) but we can also draw.. and manage...etc. perhaps we should be a higher grade than MIFA
The point of the IfA is to represent archaeology (or should I say heritage) in general. SO... you can have a pifa illustrator or digger or sup[ervisor or forensic or osteologist etc... and you could also have a MiFA digger or illustrator or osteo...etc... personally I think you should either be a member or a licentiate.. as IfA like teh AAI&S and the subs are far too small to allow for paid admin... which seems to be the basic reasoning behind the merger idea.
Now correct me if I am wrong
Forensic Science Society... British Assoc. of Biological Anthropology and Osteoarchaeology.... Historical Metallurgy Society etc...etc......... all these are good working associations dealing with sub disciplines for archaeology representing the specialists... perhaps they should all give up ... them and more... and the IfA becomes the only body for everything... and I will then merge as well..
:face-approve:
Biifa! BAJR Inside the I F A
pps Trowel... I do see what you are getting at... I think the idea that MIFA means one thing.. and that is management is out dated (don't mean it ain't true!) MIFA means you are the best at the subdiscipline - whatever that is.
Proposed AAI&S and IfA merger - BAJR - 4th June 2010
http://www.bajrfed.co.uk/showthread.php?3286-Drew-Smith-Archaeological-Illustration
sould give you some idea of the skill of the illustrator.. and he is of course an AAI&S member.. worth MIFA... I think so