+- BAJR Federation Archaeology (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk)
+-- Forum: BAJR Federation Forums (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: The Site Hut (http://www.bajrfed.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Thread: Pay Scales (/showthread.php?tid=1768)
Pay Scales - BAJR Host - 9th June 2004
Ah .. I should now come clean about just who/what BAJR does. When I am not spending days and nights on BAJR I am ... 2 days a wekk as a planning Archaeologist in a Council and the rest of the time I am a Consultant/Contractor/Whatever... (though not anywhere near my County!!) I fell I am in a fairly unique position of being both Gamekeeper and Poacher (its up to you to decide which is which!!)
With that in mind, I feel that As a Planning Archaeologist I am seeing a more distinct divide between those who consult and those who carry ou the work. It is easy to look at consultants as those that sleep with the enemy.. however.. it is the enemy tht pays for most archaeology in the UK. I have welcomed this more professional aspect.. though my caveat is that I will not tolerate cowboy activity - whether it is a one man consultant or a 'Big' Unit. At the end of the day we are all pulling in the same direction (or should be) and that is ensuring the archaeology and fragile heritage of the UK is cared for.
IF a consultant can come up with a cunning plan to let a gravel quarry go ahead and it is workable... then good ... if a contractor can get the work done to the highest standard (but at a competitive cost without cutting safety, wages or quality of service) then good. Lets not get too precious about what we do... but also let us not forget what we do
Cue the sound of stirring Elgar style music!!
To return to the wages thing.. I choose Council guides, because we have to start somewhere... and at least I am able to point to recognised standards and levels (hence the new Levels/Responsibility Grades) and I have to say that since BAJR introduced them there has been only ONE slight grumble! Pensions are difficult (especially on short contracts.. but there are clear guidelines on this including sizee of organisation etc.... As to security... we will just have to wait - though I feel that we will never escape from the wandering digger.. and personally I would not want to... Be a digger for 3-7 years... if you are still a digger then either enjoy it or leave it - cos otherwise you ain't going to be anything other than a digger... and then the choice is yours.
Anyway... time for me to shut up and get back to work!!
BAJR Host
Pay Scales - drpeterwardle - 12th June 2004
Why cant we give the in effect voluntry BAJR pay scales a try for a while - I think they are very useful.
There is one point about a free market place that nobody has mentioned - if you want better staff you simply pay more than the competitors. If there is a shortage of people the pay rates will rise quickly. In the SE UK plumbers earn more than lawyers at present.
Peter Wardle
Pay Scales - the invisible man - 18th June 2004
This same debate seems to be spread over at least two threads!
I can't really see voluntary pay scales working in the real world, unless by chance they are round about the "natural" level that employers will pay anyway which makes them a bit pontless (and as a bit of a pinko it grieves me to say this!)
If and when there are more vacancies than potential employees, the employers will (reluctantly) have to offer more to get the staff, and they will ignore the pay scales.
When there are more staff after jobs than there are jobs to go around, the employers will pay the minimum possible, and again ignore the pay scales if they can. After all, they do have to compete to win the work in the first place.
It's the way of the world I'm afraid. Maybe the better question would be, is commercial archaeology an appropriate, or the best, way to perform archaeology in the first place?
Pay Scales - BAJR Host - 18th June 2004
[:0] very interesting point Invisible man...
I would say though that 74 companies that now advertise / use BAJR and they are all complying with the pay scales. Now if there are companies that do not appear on the BAJR list (there are a few of you out there!!) and they do not pay the levels that are set on BAJR... then may I suggest that people do not work for them! At the moment there is a desparate need for Diggers and Field workers.. so use that and work for only those that pay BAJR levels... that way the companies that pay under will be forced to match the wages or have only the 83 year old one legged blind diggers to choose from.
If you know a unit that does pay fair and should be included on the BAJR list of Who's Who in contractors... get in touch... its free its easy and it gets them seen... they do not even need to advertise.
All it takes is a commitment to pay fair, have a policy on H&S, etc and uphold the IFA Code of Conduct (you do not even have to be a member to uphold it!!)
New topic [?] Should archaeology be commercial????
Pay Scales - the invisible man - 22nd June 2004
Hmm, I would suggest that this is because you set the BAJR scales at the level of actual prevailing pay rates.
If there is a desperate shortage of diggers, in theory the pay rates should go up. If they do not it suggests that the employers are unable to pay more, that is, tenders submitted by units are too low. This is interesting, and I would expect pay rates and tenders to start to creep up.
But if you CAN get someone to work for 200 quid a week, that is what will be offered. The cycle needs to be broken somehow.
Pay Scales - BAJR Host - 27th August 2004
See the new topic about pay bargaining...
Not something I really wanted to get into... but it seems that BAJR is in a unique position of having no axe to grind, no affiliations, no commitees no financial gain etc etc... this makes BAJR a good place to funnel change through.
I will be strongly advising students not to accept jobs that pay less than the BAJR rec min.
Apart from the odd mistake.. BAJR will never post jobs that ray less than is set... that way... only groups who pay above the min will appear on BAJR (good or bad conditions aside - that will change also)
Many people do not appear on BAJR but pay well above the scale, however... it is up to the digger to challange poor pay as much as it is for organisations to implement change at the top