What should the level of the 2009 pay rise be

[Noddy]

quote:Originally posted by drpeterwardle
Inflation was 3% before the cut in VAT and is now under 2%. There is a possibility that deflation might occur. Fuel prices are down massively. Mortgages are cheaper and there are deals on everything.

Where are you getting your figures from? They don't match the Office of National Statistics. It's either 0.1% or 3.0% depending which figure you use. The government use the latter.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?ID=19

While I have sympathy for small businesses, and know that many engineering consultancies have frozen wages, freezing wages would be a disaster for many archaeologists. 'Benchmarking the profession' found that archaeologists needed a 13-53% pay rise to get pay to the same level as comparable professions. Small businesses would be getting a bargain if there is a 3% pay rise. I also find it slightly ridiculous that you say mortgages are cheaper, yet you must know many archaeologists are not in a position to get a mortgage and even if they were, they would not get one on a temporary/fixed term contract in the current climate. Incidentally six of the nine current job postings are temporary/fixed term.

[shavedmonkey]

Why do I find it worrying that an employer should be asking the forum what he should pay his staff?

[YellowPete]

there are many sides to this.

No companies equals no work other than through the old boy/girl network and locality.

This would be a major back step from a professional status and probably cost us the heritage bill.

Ask or demand too much, such as comparable professional wages, then the next time we are caught short and end up totally out of it.

Also if we ask or demand too much and there is no compromise then it starts as a tinder for the rest to kick off.

where again we don't even deserve a heritage bill.

So we are left with wanting to preserve the industry, yet also develop it.

But remember much as we are professionals we are also hobby types.

we don't do this unless we love it and half the fun is the conditions, very character building................yeah, I can hardly stop myself from crying either, at that!

Its sad to say but we each have to decide whether we, individually are worth more than a few pennies.



txt is
Mike

[drpeterwardle]

Shaved Monkey said:

"Why do I find it worrying that an employer should be asking the forum what he should pay his staff?"

Have to say I find this statement worrying. I am asking what the BAJR/IFA rate should be not what the pay rise for my staff will be. That is a matter purely for them and me.

As for the notion:
"Further, well run businesses should also be factoring further price increases in wages as well as other general rises in business expenses (not telling anyone out there how to suck eggs!)."

On some dba contracts a 1.5% price difference is the difference between winning and losing the contract. A price increase of say 5% to cover a 3% wage increase that your competitors don?t implement will make a major difference.

Peter

[Oxbeast]

"I also find it slightly ridiculous that you say mortgages are cheaper, yet you must know many archaeologists are not in a position to get a mortgage and even if they were, they would not get one on a temporary/fixed term contract in the current climate. Incidentally six of the nine current job postings are temporary/fixed term."

Noddy, you can get a mortgage on a temporary/fixed term contract, I just got one in december. Rolling contracts, usually annual, are pretty common in industry nowadays, and it doesn't seem to bother the lenders particularly. Admittedly it was a ten month contract, not a two week one.

Although I am tied to the LGA/Unison collective bargaining, I would be willing to have a rise close to inflation, with a commitment to the benchmarking project afterwards, when the economy improves. Otherwise benchmarking aganinst other professions is at risk of being put off indefinately as it is simply not in the interests of the management of archaeological companies.

[voice of reason]

There is no need to debate the IfA level, it is already set -

http://www.archaeologists.net/modules/ne...toryid=346

- minimum levels will rise by same % as CPI at 1 April. The relevant CPI will be announced next week (currently 3% but likely to hurtle downwards seems to be the prediction).

And get real - putting prices up is not an option in the current climate. Many major housebuilders/construction companies, as well as smaller concerns, are actively requiring savings of 10% or more, and clear demonstration of evidence that these are real reductions. This is occurring during existing projects. This is a buyer's market for archaeological services, not a seller's.

[YellowPete]

given the interest rates on the student loans I would suggest an extra ?1000 a yr.

Either that or learn to get by on a ?10 a week.

txt is
Mike

[drpeterwardle]

Thanks for that VoR. I have forgotten what the IFA said in December and of course it was before their redundancy survey. That just leaves David to set the BAJR rate.

Have to say the IFA actions are making the RAOs less competative with these enforced pay rates.

Ok lets discuss a different tack. Is it OK for an organisation that pays above the minimum to freeze it pay in a bad year?

Peter

[Mike.T.]

quote:Originally posted by YellowPete


given the interest rates on the student loans I would suggest an extra ?1000 a yr.

Either that or learn to get by on a ?10 a week.

txt is
Mike

What ?? [?]

[YellowPete]

On the Research Assesment Exercise thread I mentioned a conservative national student loan debt of around ?11.8 Billion where I can't afford to pay the interest, unless I scrap a living with just ?10 a week to spend on me and my consumer ways.



txt is
Mike