IfA Minima Debate - THE RESULT

[Martin Locock]

If you were a member you could stand for council and change things.

[BAJR]

Just in from Amanda... who is having trouble ( like some others - I am working on it ) in signing in...


I just wanted to say that ROs are included in the compliance to salary minima to advertise on JIS - they pay for their adverts via their RO fees.

We do include some adverts on JIS which are non archaeological posts picked up and re-posted (such as some of the NT lists and EH lists), which we think members may be interested in, but which do not pay the minima expected for archaeological jobs - these ones are the ones that are not paid for referred to in the statement.

@ Martin.
Exactly right. if people want to have a council that represents them, then they can stand for Council. That way, the decision becomes theirs. Power is there if you take it?

[Oxbeast]

It took me a few read throughs to get the gist of it, but the IfA has decided to get rid of salary minima, is that right? And is this supposed to encourage people to pay the much higher 'recommended' salaries? Otherwise they threaten to (possibly) not allow advertising? As for an audit that "ensures that it has appropriately competent staff at its disposal": of course these ROs have appropriately competent staff. They are the POs who have been working for years at £18.5K.

Is anyone out there getting as much as the recommended salaries? Are there any diggers on £19,853? Are there any supervisors/POs on £29,123? Are any ROs ever going to jump to these levels if they don't have to?

[redexile]

If you were a member you could stand for council and change things.

Oh please, not that old one again: "the blame for anything that the IfA does lies squarely at the feet of people who aren't members". Why would I want to join an organization that espouses a system (free-market, developer-led archaeology) which I oppose and is clearly not working? I loathe the Tory party, I'm not going to join that and attempt to change it.

[BAJR]

To be fair, as the IfA is the only professional organisation out there... and it would be best to not let this turn into a WTF IFA - this is a case in point.

Only people invoveld in the IfA could be on the Council... only those Council could affect a change.

This did affect us all. and brought us together to campaign. it had... and this is up to people to decide... either no effect.. some effect or real effect.

I too will not join Tory Party.... but then there are options for me to support other parties OR I support no party and do not vote, then I really can't complain that the Tories do what they do.

BAJR had always been seen as the pure opposite of the IfA However... one thing it is not is a member organisation with rules and sanctions... :0

Martin spoke exactly what is true. to effect change in teh IfA Council you will have to be in it vote for those you want to see in it. The rest of us ( oh... hold on... I am a MIFA ) er... you... will have to organise

[Paul123]

So the council have effectively abolished minimum pay for all grades.


unbelieveable

[Unitof1]

is it alright to employ somebody who is not pifa and would they be allowed to fill in context sheets?

[redexile]

To be fair, as the IfA is the only professional organisation out there... and it would be best to not let this turn into a WTF IFA

Er.. this is a thread about the IfA minima, yes? I would strongly advise anyone who is a member who disagrees with what they've done to cancel their membership over this, and send them an email telling them why they've done it. Once their subscriptions fall off a cliff, they might actually start thinking about what their membership wants rather than implementing whatever the management at big units decides is the right course of action. Then again, they might not, but if that's the case, at least you're not wasting your money.

This minima make no difference to me whatsoever in terms of my personal conditions (and neither do the IfA generally, for that matter), but I still think it's one of the most spineless sell-outs I've ever seen in my life.

[GnomeKing]

FAIL.
eg; why should paying the minima or recommended rates ensure staff are suitably skilled/trained/motivated(!) ?, never-mind those payed below those rates ..............

since these 'standards' are rather hard to define, do not relate specifically to technical standards, and already are poorly applied, one wonders what criteria will actually be used to judge whether companies paying below-rate are worthy of the JIS ?
(does KA seek to make reality match data?)

will this be another tick-box exercise, or is there some meat yet to come?
The only criteria i can think of is the individual experience of the 'underpaid' archaeologist...BUT this obviously wont work!
An audit of the CVs of employed/self-employed staff at a Suspect Company will only highlight any under-skilled staff (and of course only those at the bottom most likely) However; Many highly skilled/experienced people are ALREADY working in-grades/at-rates well below the minima, let alone the recommended rates.

Presumably the view will be that these people (rightly or wrongly) have willingly chosen to work at the lower rate - eg by way of contract. What then the purpose of the exercise? >>> this decision has allowed mechanisms to be created which very firmly cements the already powerful position of the largest ROs.

It takes a large step towards allowing these RO's to effectively regulate themselves, whilst potentially suppressing their competition.

Since an RO can already effectively argue the toss over skill-sets etc at will (eg redundancy proceedings...), it will be very easy for them to designate 'skills' and 'roles' however they want. Thus, it will be fairly simple to demonstrate why its perfectly fine for them to pay whatever they deem 'reasonable' for any of the 'roles' they designate.

(not to mention the Invisible Hand of the recession. weep, weep. boo, hoo.)


-When the overskilled/underpaid employee is found, what exactly will the IFA do, if that person has signed an employment contract?

-When underskilled/underpaid staff are located, presumably the employer will argue that they are protecting the wages of more experienced staff, and providing valuable 'training' (at reduced wages). Presumably the IFA, with its commitment to CPD, will heartily applaud this, and hand out gold stars.

-What, i wonder, will the procedure be when underskilled/over-paid individuals are located?


No, this is not good. Empty words about a commitment to standards are not the same as monitoring your existing members properly. This is the root of many problems.
Also, it might take some time for the effects to be really noticed, as am am sure the big ROs' are playing a long game here....


POSTSCRIPT:
perhapes no surprise at poorly thought position of self-employed...after all KA has no data on that...
Which reminds me of a customer satisfaction survey technique, where the question 'are you dissatisfied' is specifically not asked. Then, with a straight face, one can truthfully assert 'no customer indicated they were dissatisfied'....

[Unitof1]

How much should a mifa be paid to fill in a context sheet?