11th February 2011, 06:17 PM
Interesting discussion....
lets take the key example raised : employees go to office (load van)>> van driven by 1 employee goes to site >>>7.5 hours work then done at site >>> return journey to office (unload etc)
Lets take a fictional large unit, perhaps with a university sounding name.
They pay drivers for their time driving + some recognition of loading/unloading, usually with supervisors....supervisors and above are also paid for travel time, as they are still 'responsible', and also for 'office duties' at start/end of day.
This generally seems to be Fair Practice, although perhaps often not all supervisors/PO time gets accounted for, and perhaps often no time is really scheduled for the (legal) vehicle checks.....maybe some room for improvement in that regard then
HOWEVER
It is clear that the diggers are at work the moment they arrive at the office, day after day after day : - they often in company logo kit, they may be handling company equipment, they are on company premises or vehicle, they have to obey a company hierarchy >>> they have to abide by company RULES, and all normal workplace SANCTIONS can be taken against them....
If that does not constitute a place of work, then WHAT DOES? , and more importantly, if not a place of work, WHAT IS IT? - it certainly can not be defined as the employees 'own' time.
RE: being paid to sleep and fart in vans....you F***ing kidding me!!!! right....?
the work as a digger is HARD...you SHOULD know that...the money is poor (REMEMBER?)...and yet you persist with your scrouge-ing blether?
How much does does a Consultants fart cost? Does Executive bottom-talk smell better? - -
Fictional unit with university sounding name might even go as far to throw 'lavish' receptions for Execs, Sponsors, Friends, Trustees etc (where farting, and sleeping after too much CHEAP wine is all at company expense) --- and yet do nothing for the poor saps locked up in the back of vans hour after hour, day after day, fart after fart....
blether bletehr recession blahblah bleteherblah working hard together blether(snore)
PAY me - perhaps i will fart less, oui? >>> better yet, COMPENSATE me for my enforced hours in TOXIC gassesxx(
BLetherBlah...."but other jobs/professionals don't get paid for that time " blah
..>er, they DO, ...if they don't, they also are caught out in the Huge-Construction-Industry-Scam to abidcate responsibility with swarms of cash-starved sub-contractors....
"but the economy will fail, my company will close, your job will go, Western Society will Collapse, we'll have to eat our babies, and TURTLES MIGHT DIE!!!"xx(
NO - we are not going to further compromise our living standards so as 'you' can maintain your Profits....workers at the bottom of the ladder will not put up with 'Austerity' while those at the top suck ever harder on their Blood, Body and Soul.
If they can sell-out their human employees so easily, what do you think will happen to the Archaeology as $$Fenrix?? bites ever deeper?
If a simple thing such as Responible & Proper proviosn of Time In-Lieu can not be sorted by a strong body of working professionals, then really what kind of a pretence has been made to sort out anything at all?
[ DON'T BELIEVE The Austerity Scam ! - Resist The Auction of our Country - March For The Alternative 26/3/2011 ]
There is opportunity here for progressive practice,.... for example by a unit that Actually Cares.
If not, then 'our' vans will continue to reek of Farts, Discontent, and barely consicous Malice.
On this Journey, your
Vision, however 'human',
a Wan*er will make of thee.
lets take the key example raised : employees go to office (load van)>> van driven by 1 employee goes to site >>>7.5 hours work then done at site >>> return journey to office (unload etc)
Lets take a fictional large unit, perhaps with a university sounding name.
They pay drivers for their time driving + some recognition of loading/unloading, usually with supervisors....supervisors and above are also paid for travel time, as they are still 'responsible', and also for 'office duties' at start/end of day.
This generally seems to be Fair Practice, although perhaps often not all supervisors/PO time gets accounted for, and perhaps often no time is really scheduled for the (legal) vehicle checks.....maybe some room for improvement in that regard then
HOWEVER
It is clear that the diggers are at work the moment they arrive at the office, day after day after day : - they often in company logo kit, they may be handling company equipment, they are on company premises or vehicle, they have to obey a company hierarchy >>> they have to abide by company RULES, and all normal workplace SANCTIONS can be taken against them....
If that does not constitute a place of work, then WHAT DOES? , and more importantly, if not a place of work, WHAT IS IT? - it certainly can not be defined as the employees 'own' time.
RE: being paid to sleep and fart in vans....you F***ing kidding me!!!! right....?
the work as a digger is HARD...you SHOULD know that...the money is poor (REMEMBER?)...and yet you persist with your scrouge-ing blether?
How much does does a Consultants fart cost? Does Executive bottom-talk smell better? - -
Fictional unit with university sounding name might even go as far to throw 'lavish' receptions for Execs, Sponsors, Friends, Trustees etc (where farting, and sleeping after too much CHEAP wine is all at company expense) --- and yet do nothing for the poor saps locked up in the back of vans hour after hour, day after day, fart after fart....
blether bletehr recession blahblah bleteherblah working hard together blether(snore)
PAY me - perhaps i will fart less, oui? >>> better yet, COMPENSATE me for my enforced hours in TOXIC gassesxx(
BLetherBlah...."but other jobs/professionals don't get paid for that time " blah
..>er, they DO, ...if they don't, they also are caught out in the Huge-Construction-Industry-Scam to abidcate responsibility with swarms of cash-starved sub-contractors....
"but the economy will fail, my company will close, your job will go, Western Society will Collapse, we'll have to eat our babies, and TURTLES MIGHT DIE!!!"xx(
NO - we are not going to further compromise our living standards so as 'you' can maintain your Profits....workers at the bottom of the ladder will not put up with 'Austerity' while those at the top suck ever harder on their Blood, Body and Soul.
If they can sell-out their human employees so easily, what do you think will happen to the Archaeology as $$Fenrix?? bites ever deeper?
If a simple thing such as Responible & Proper proviosn of Time In-Lieu can not be sorted by a strong body of working professionals, then really what kind of a pretence has been made to sort out anything at all?
[ DON'T BELIEVE The Austerity Scam ! - Resist The Auction of our Country - March For The Alternative 26/3/2011 ]
There is opportunity here for progressive practice,.... for example by a unit that Actually Cares.
If not, then 'our' vans will continue to reek of Farts, Discontent, and barely consicous Malice.
On this Journey, your
Vision, however 'human',
a Wan*er will make of thee.