Current job advert

[Boxoffrogs]

Either a job title has status or it does not. If not then pay scales are a waste of time and we are into free fall on pay. A stand needs to be taken as in the current job market someone will work for less regardless of the wage. Internships are being BOUGHT by students today ie paying employers to go to work for them out of need. Do we really want to see more of this creep into our profession?

[gonetopot]

People may rant over what 'project officer' actually means, especially on site, but I note that both the positions are office-based. In practice and in my experience with several units, this basically means different levels of writing things up. I'm not sure you can apply the same hierarchical structure, unless you take into account POs in the office must liase with specialists etc. I suppose you could ask for one to be called a 'Report writer' or something similar but I think thats a bit pedantic.

Its also a bit of supply and demand - lets face it no unit is swimming in money and there are alot of archs looking for jobs...and there are always more graduates with osteo MAs looking for jobs than you can shake a stick at.

[Oxbeast]

From what I understand of employment law, job titles do not have any status.

It is the job as it is constituted which is important and protected. This is what prevents employers from changing your job title slightly and using the change as an excuse to get rid of you. If your job description changes (by a certain percentage), you might have to reapply for your own job, but your job title can change underneath you as long as the job description stays the same.

You could just as easily have a hierarchy of pay grades which goes:
Entry level 1
entry level 2
middle manager 1
middle manager 2
senior manager
director

but it wouldn't mean very much without some accompanying stuff about levels of responsibility.

[P Prentice]

i think it looks very like a cynical attempt to bring down wages and pay less than an appropriate rate rate because supply outstrips demand. this is the state of the market and it will get worse

[BAJR]

just to say... a rewording has been prepared after further discussion. although i can't say hand on heart i like the name po for this position - it is what they use. however the person will be basicly being the junior of a team - the job is permenant and the potential to continue up gade is there. so it squeezes in. i do try to ensure no slippage. however am always happy to discuss. unusually allowing this debate in public.

[JSA]

[DELETED BY BAJR] , BAJR must surely have bought at least a speedboat [DELETED BY BAJR]

[vulpes]

The company in question has long employed supervisors and called them POs. I wouldn't hold out any hope for progression up the grades either, it has not been recorded since the current regime climbed that greasy pole and pulled it up after them. The grade you are appointed at will likely be it until you make your escape. That said, a job is a job and the respective locales are very pleasant. (allegedly):face-approve:

[stinker pinker]

surely that is some sort of breach of aup... besides if it is true then the greasy pole must have been pulled up since, er, monday, when some members of staff were indeed promoted. Also is anyone seriously suggesting that someone should be paid ?20,914.57 for writing DBAs?

[differentcolourmud]

So when after 3 months a load of extra work/responsibility is dumped on them with no change in pay they'll be told 'but you're a project officer, you have to do it' - and we all end up on minimum wage. great one bajr.

the pay scales arent that wide ranging. The dba role suggests that dba's are now be done by 'basic site assistants'. The report writing role clearly seems to cover everything upto and including publication - while ?23685.72 does technically hit the G 5/6 : (ie Senior Specialist, SMR post and Project Officer or Junior Manager) level its a bit of a cheek to have the absolute max pay only reach, to the exact penny, the minimum for that grade.

get them to knock the penny off and advertise it as a G5 role -with the according reduction in responsibilities.


and stinker pinker why not? a dba should be as good a piece of research as anything else, and 20k isnt exactly vast riches. If we can't aim for that sort of pay we may as well just drag anyone in off the street to write our reports

[RedEarth]

The whole thing is still pretty whiffy since surely most people have a reasonable idea of what 'project officer' means as a title, in fact BAJRs own pay grades even include it:

G 4/5 : (ie Senior Technical / Supervisor / Junior Project Officer ) ?19,669.86 (?378.26pw)
G 5 : (ie Specialist 1, or Project Officer SMR Asst. ?20,914.57
G 5/6 : (ie Senior Specialist, SMR post and Project Officer or Junior Manager) ?23,685.72

Note that is starting at grade 4/5 and moving up, not starting at grade 2, 3 or 4. If those terms are so meaningless why are they there? It just looks like an immensely cynical way to get someone with more experience to work for less pay.

If people don't like titles then they can get used to being screwed over and poorly paid forever. Besides, certain titles have absolutely certain meanings - you can't be described as director of a company if you aren't because it is a legal definition for example, I can't go around calling myself prime minster or the host of the BAJR website because that would be patently untrue, a fraud if you like. So, how much of an untruth are these ads peddling? As as for AUP, the information is there for everyone to see on the jobs site, so sue.