Sexual harassment

[mathmatika]

Actually rather than 'Put up and shut up' I think your mail demonstrates the opposite. If you allow people to get away with this kind of abuse, it doesn't go away. It just gives the abusers free rein to carry on.

But on a positive note, if you have suffered for so long it strikes me that you would have s strong case for constructive dismissal. You must seek advice on how to take this matter further.

Kevin, I recognised Beasley's experience and understood why s/he came to the conclusion to "Put up and shut up." It doesn't automatically follow that making a complaint and, or, challenging harassment or bullying prevents people from 'getting away' with abuse, or limits abusive behaviour. I have worked within commercial archaeology for just over a year with seven different companies, and compared to other industries I have found both managers and site assistants largely ignorant of good working practice and also reluctant to challenge the racism, sexism and bullying that appears widespread. My experience has been that the few individuals who do complain, or challenge abusive behaviour/comments, open themselves to (further) isolation, ridicule, bullying and loss of a potential reference. I recognise and appreciate your supportive comments on many subjects Kevin, but I would suggest that the burden of making progress in these areas does not rest solely with those who have been harassed, but with all of us working within field archaeology. Unless we all challenge attitudes and behaviour on a daily basis, we allow an environment conducive to harassment and bullying (of all kinds).

I would welcome contact with anyone with the energy and conviction to make a change within commercial field archaeology so that equal opportunities and harassment/bullying policies are effective.

[Jack]

I'm probably gonna get in trouble for even raising the following issue, but I feel I have to point something out......

But as a proviso:
Of course I am against bullying, the strong picking on the weak, those with power abusing those without.
And the thought of sexual harassment makes me so angry its best not to vocalise.
I in no way condone the picking on or harassing of anyone.
And in no way do I want to make excuses for anyone abusing their position or co-workers in such a way.
Furthermore, I do not want to belittle anyone's horrific experiences of real abuse.

However,
I do feel there is miscommunication and misunderstanding between generations that grew up in very different worlds.

There should be a free and open discussion of peoples experiences, expectations and understandings.

Friendly banter can be taken as abuse; but abuse can be disguised or even encouraged as harmless ribbing.

I have seen a PO knocked sideways by an accusation of bullying that was potentially a product of political maneuvering, gossip and ambition rather than any real grievance.
I have seen diggers bully their PO/supervisor through the complaints system or friendship with management.
I have seen and experienced threats of violence from the clients subcontractors.
I know of one co-worker who was threatened with a shotgun by a farmer, and others who have been chased by dogs.
I have experienced racism from a client.

Some of us grew up in a world where we were taught to deal with bullying by 'standing up for ourselves.....as no one else would.' A world where initiation pranks were the norm. A world where teasing and ribbing were a sign of friendship and/or respect. A world where 'names will never hurt me'

However, some of us have grown up in a world where certain words are unacceptable. A world where bullying is dealt with by accusation, suspension, investigation in closed rooms. A world where internet gossip is king. And trial by internet is accepted. A world where name calling is taken to the high court and a court order can stop you speaking the truth.

These two worlds can be incompatible. But can be reconciled through discussion and understanding.

[Kel]

A world where bullying is dealt with by accusation, suspension, investigation in closed rooms.

...

These two worlds can be incompatible. But can be reconciled through discussion and understanding.

So do you see mediation as the initial way forward when dealing with an accusation of bullying? Some of the examples being expressed in this thread hardly seem condusive to being discussed away and are all too easily understood as power-based. I can see that some kind of discussion-based approach would quickly lead to the bully gaining the upper hand. That's what they do. If a bully calls me a b***h and I call him a b*****d in return, I'm the one who will end up with a formal warning. It's no longer the case that you can "stand up for yourself". Bullies know how to work a system to their advantage.

Don't get me wrong - I'm a woman who did 20+ years' hard-time in IT, which is a total sausage-fest and could show archaeology a few things about sex and gender-based bullying and discrimination. I survived that quite comfortably. But bullies are bullies and there's no reconciling with them. People who bully maliciously need to be dealt with formally and appropriately, or they assume they can get away with more and it escalates. Full-on bullying is rarely a bit of harmless banter or the inappropriate use of language.

[BAJR]

Now this has returned to the fore... there is an interesting pattern appearing - one that could be dealt with... formalised and used as a policy...

I myself remember being on both the receiving end and giving as good as... back in teh day... childish pranks... harmless banter etc... which could and in the odd occasion did get out of hand.

That was then and this is now... and that is the difference.

Just as it was once acceptable to wear a bobble hat and flairs as reasonable protective clothing. or getting in the JCB bucket to take pictures was fine... now it is reasonable to have guidelines for acceptable behaviour.

When we sit down and give the H&S talk, the site safety, the company policy on harassment must be made clear. and a clear position taken. so nobody NOBODY (PM, PO, supervisor or site archaeologist ) is in any doubt as to what is acceptable., We don't want to live in a humourless environment, but lets remember we are professionals, we should act as such... the 80s have gone now... lets start acting like a profession.

Full-on bullying is rarely a bit of harmless banter or the inappropriate use of language as Kevin says Jack is right in his reversal discussion... and is also right that the old and new of the two worlds can be incompatible. But can be reconciled through discussion and understanding. First however. lines and parameters must be created.. read, agreed and enforced.

Then no-one is in any doubt/

[RedEarth]

So do you see mediation as the initial way forward when dealing with an accusation of bullying? Some of the examples being expressed in this thread hardly seem condusive to being discussed away and are all too easily understood as power-based. I can see that some kind of discussion-based approach would quickly lead to the bully gaining the upper hand. That's what they do. If a bully calls me a b***h and I call him a b*****d in return, I'm the one who will end up with a formal warning. It's no longer the case that you can "stand up for yourself". Bullies know how to work a system to their advantage.

Don't get me wrong - I'm a woman who did 20+ years' hard-time in IT, which is a total sausage-fest and could show archaeology a few things about sex and gender-based bullying and discrimination. I survived that quite comfortably. But bullies are bullies and there's no reconciling with them. People who bully maliciously need to be dealt with formally and appropriately, or they assume they can get away with more and it escalates. Full-on bullying is rarely a bit of harmless banter or the inappropriate use of language.

Is the term 'sausage-fest' not fairly insulting and derogatory? I take that assuming that all the men were as complicit as each other in whatever bad things went on...

[BAJR]

Not so to me ( as a man - I find it quite descriptive ) ... it is urban slang mainly used by men to describe a party that has a larger number of men than females. THe term sausage to describe a penis is perhaps not so bad. Do you feel it is insulting? If so, then you could add any gender based comment to the list of inappropriate remarks. This is what we need to create. a reasonable line that can't be crossed. and teh ability for people who do find it inappropriate to be able to say so, without fear of ridicule and further bullying.

The same goes for religion, race and sexual orientation - and body shape for that matter. If teh comments are designed to hurt. then they are inappropriate. if they make others feel uncomfortable ... then they are inappropriate. If people are misconstruing what you say... then ask yourself why?

[Wax]

"Some of us grew up in a world where we were taught to deal with bullying by 'standing up for ourselves.....as no one else would.' A world where initiation pranks were the norm. A world where teasing and ribbing were a sign of friendship and/or respect. A world where 'names will never hurt me'

However, some of us have grown up in a world where certain words are unacceptable. A world where bullying is dealt with by accusation, suspension, investigation in closed rooms. A world where internet gossip is king. And trial by internet is accepted. A world where name calling is taken to the high court and a court order can stop you speaking the truth"

Jack is so right and it is the fine line between these two attitudes that is so difficult to draw. As someone who has always found practical jokes un funny and in many cases hurtful I have often been very uncomfortable around what others seem to think is reasonable banter and joshing especially when they are verbally putting someone down behind their back. I am clear in my own head what constitutes bullying and harasment when it comes to me personally having a very low personal tolerance threshold and will stand up for myself. What I am not clear on is when I should step in for colleagues and have found it very difficult to judge this.

Like some others here I went through the world of work when sexism, racisim and general bullying were rife and find things so much better now that I often wonder what it is that people are complaining about. I do think Jack is right, there is a disconnect between the generations and is the harasing and bulling within the archaeological world or is it coming from the world of the contractors and their sub contractors we have to work with? I found the archaeological world far less tolerant of the ongoing racism and sexism you find in the constrution industry with Archaeologists more accepting of differences in general and having a work force that is diverse (though not as diverse as it could or should be.)

Perhaps we need to define what is acceptable beheaviour I know it is defined in law but it can be difficult to recognise and apply this in the world of work.

Oh and telling someone their work is not up to standard and they need to do better is not bullying!

[Kel]

Is the term 'sausage-fest' not fairly insulting and derogatory? I take that assuming that all the men were as complicit as each other in whatever bad things went on...

As Hostie pointed out, it's a slang term to indicate a male majority. If you find it insulting, then I apologise. But as the "oppressed minority" I'd find that gently amusing.

[RedEarth]

As Hostie pointed out, it's a slang term to indicate a male majority. If you find it insulting, then I apologise. But as the "oppressed minority" I'd find that gently amusing.

I think in the context hosty used it, as a slang term referring to a party with more men than women, it's hard to find it too insulting and I have heard it used in that way (although the implication is surely 'sad desperate men outnumbering the, therefore less sad and desperate women' is surely fairly insulting). However, used in the context of describing a workplace I would say it is pretty inappropriate and potentially insulting. I don't think it would bother me but I'd pretty embarrassed for the poor sod who used it. I assume calling a workplace dominated by women a 'mellon fest' or similar would be OK then?

The point is that it may or may not be seen as offensive depending on the circumstances but one can't assume anything.

[Kel]

I think in the context hosty used it, as a slang term referring to a party with more men than women

Which is how I was using it.

(although the implication is surely 'sad desperate men outnumbering the, therefore less sad and desperate women' is surely fairly insulting)

.
Which is not how I was using it. Nor was I aware of any such usage. Indeed in the first 30 entries for the term in Urban Dictionary, I was unable to find any reference to sadness or desperation, so I'm unclear as to where that alternative interpretation originated. http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.ph...usage+fest

The point is that it may or may not be seen as offensive depending on the circumstances but one can't assume anything.

There's always a possibility that someone will misinterpret what you're saying. But given the context of this conversation, it seems a bit rich for a throwaway piece of slang to be misinterpreted and then used to 'demonstrate' that women can be sexist and then somehow divert the topic to being about how men are the victims. It would not have been a sensible assumption that this was going to occur.