What should the level of the 2009 pay rise be

[BAJR Host]

I think what Peter is suggesting is an option, where a company can pay more if it wants. A price freeze is also an option, as is a wait and see option...

I will be having a discussion about this, and will be sending out the normal consultation document to gather the opinions of all the companies who employ. Being realistic is the only option.. It may be interesting to see those that raise rates and those that don't (I already have knowledge of some companies who are implementing pay rises whatever the April CPI - ps.. for those waiting to see what is happening -
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?ID=19

the next CPI comes out on 24 March 2009

we have to remember that though costs appear to be coming down, this is not as 'good as it looks' VAT is down 2.5 percent and mortgage payments are down.. does this help field staff and specialists though? It will help companies and permanent staff to a degree.

BAJR will do nothing to cause job losses or act against the general consensus.. (I don't have that right - but then.. who does? It is up to companies to decide what they pay after all. ) Companies need to know though.. as last year showed.. the lack of knowing what to pay as a minimum (a minimum mind!) makes bidding for contracts hard.

Should have something next week)

?When a sinister person means to be your enemy, they always start by trying to become your friend.?
William Blake

[drpeterwardle]

Thanks for that David.

What I have decided is that staff will get a pay rise the question is how much. At the moment there is so much uncertainty it is difficult to know how much above inflation that pay rise should be.

Peter

[YellowPete]

I don't want to patronise or anything, but just remember that incrementals may be drip fed in to a point where it is still controlable, but flooding with cash is what brought us here in the first place.

feeling it out on all the esentials, is the only way to work it out.

What are the basics?

How long can we take the basics?

What will we loose for the basics?

People need to look at their own financial situation and decide if the cash conversion needs more imediate action, or if the prospects can leave the opportunity to the future.

drip, drip, drip, drip..................


its like chinese torture.........................



txt is
Mike

[voice of reason]

To everyone's amazement, CPI is 3.2% for March, so that will be the rise in IfA recommended minimum salaries (though obviously not a 3.2% pay rise for everyone).

[BAJR Host]

That will be discussed at the Exec Meeting I expect. Its a surprise indeed.. was watching it over the last couple of month... and it was stable as opposed to the RPI -

I for one will be happy to see the implementation of this

?the link with the local government pay settlement (which has determined the increase in IfA minimum salaries since their inception in 1996) will be broken from April 2009 and the minimum salary rates will increase in line with inflation (taken from the Consumer Price Index on 1 April 2009?

Council made the decision, so will stand by it I expect ? the question will be, can Contractors stand by it? It is a requirement for ROs to pay minimum levels so by my calculation, the base level will be

2007/8 G2 ?281.26 (Basic field Arch). Post) --#61664; ?290.26

G3 ?301.21 (Experienced or skilled field Arch) ?310.84



Many folk are already within these levels? but these are minimums?

So? lets see? roll on April?

Its never going to be easy to predict the way the money flows! :face-huh:


ps... I don't understand the comment about not everyone getting this?



?When a sinister person means to be your enemy, they always start by trying to become your friend.?
William Blake

[chiz]

wow, that must be the first time the RPI/CPI discrepancy has ever worked in our favour! I was glumly expecting that the CPI would be in deflation, whilst RPI would be far higher, and we'd get the lower rise whilst real prices soared. Its still a case though of holding our own against inflation, not catching up as implementation of the benchmarking scheme requires. Lets hope the IfA sticks to its word and implements the CPI rate. And we don't see backdoor erosion of pay and conditions such as the increase in sites being nominated as place of work to avoid paying allowances.

BUT for those units already paying above the minima (VoR's comment about not everyone getting the 3.2% rise surely relates to these employers),they don't have to put their pay up by as much to match the new minima. So I imagine in a cynical world pay for the lowest RO units coming up, and relatively speaking the higher paid units' pay coming down a bit. I hope not.
It may also relate to local govt employers with longer term pay deals already fixed?
I can see a certain 'major London unit' having its traditional problems getting anything near this rise as its pay award has to be approved by Govt....

I'd also like to take issue with Peter Wardle's comment that

quote:In the last two years there have been huge increases for archaeologists

There haven't. Not for anyone I have come into contact with. Unless, of course, you mean huge increases in debt, stress, overworking, unpaid overtime, job insecurity, training or appraisal deficiency...
What do you mean by your comment?

And finally, David, you spoke about not deciding a BAJR rate rise till June? Do it now, backdated pay rises are a nightmare, and directly shaft short contract diggers who won't get it. Please!

[voice of reason]

Bob's understanding of what I meant is correct - if pay is already above the minimum in an organisation, it is unlikley to be raised by 3.2%.

A big issue will be whether ROs paying below the new minimum levels can afford in the current climate to raise them, and what happens if a number of them don't? A real test for the "benefits" of being an RO - given a hard choice between staying an RO or staying in business, which way would people go? And then, the whole edifice of pay minima set unilaterally by a non-statutory body has the potenetial to come tumbling down.

Extending what Bob said, it is also a real issue for many local authority contracting units who have no discretion over their salary awards. Harsh as it may seem, it might be the push needed to sort out (ie remove) the disruptive position in the market of these contractors.

[chiz]

quote:Originally posted by voice of reason
...Extending what Bob said, it is also a real issue for many local authority contracting units who have no discretion over their salary awards. Harsh as it may seem, it might be the push needed to sort out (ie remove) the disruptive position in the market of these contractors.

and charitable trusts? do they get 'sorted out' too?:face-stir:

[kevin wooldridge]

quote:Originally posted by voice of reason

Extending what Bob said, it is also a real issue for many local authority contracting units who have no discretion over their salary awards. Harsh as it may seem, it might be the push needed to sort out (ie remove) the disruptive position in the market of these contractors.

This year was always going to be one of adjustment for local authority employed archaeologists, as it is the first year that the IFA has moved away from implementing the LA payrise as the IFA 'payrise', so to speak.

That said though there arent as many problems for LA employers as VoR might suggest. LA pay scales are big beasts and there are a whole range of salary scales and scale points upon which the salaries of archaeologists can be based. If the new IFA/BAJR minima doesn't 'fit' the current pattern, I am guessing regrading or rescaling is the answer....



With peace and consolation hath dismist, And calm of mind all passion spent...

[BAJR Host]

Thanks VoR .. just thought I would check..

LAs will have the hardest time... however, with help from BAJR?IfA et al they can change with regrading... several alreay have.


ROs will have to decide whither they go... and what benefits are there. Tough choise.. and brave move by IfA... as to back down would weaken any future plans.. but to continue may lose them ROs.. I will stand by them on this though...

My idea is that pay rates are set... however, no action will be taken on those that can't meet it, if it is impossible. (ie.. just phoning up and saying, we would like to... but can't = Not Good Enough))

The April rate will be as per 3.2%..or perhaps higher (which is actually higher than I thought .. )

There also has to be a commitment to continuing in 2010 -2013 for the further above inflation rises.



?When a sinister person means to be your enemy, they always start by trying to become your friend.?
William Blake