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21st November 2005, 07:36 PM
I was fortunate enough to do archaeology A level with a teacher who was very good at telling us these things, he made sure we went to a SMR on numerous occasions to know how they worked etc. So i was familiar with SMR's before i went to uni.
Even at Uni tho, and i went to bradford too mr invisible man (or wonder woman as i know you like to be called!) and i was told about them...i suppose it depends who you're lecturers are and what modules you choose.
I feel that SMR/HER are a vital resource. I think that in an ideal works more money should be put in to maintaining them...especially the smaller ones that are no more than a filling cabinet full of decaying bits of paper! (and no i'm not just saying that cos i work in one!)
More students SHOULD be told about their existance..they're good!
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21st November 2005, 08:15 PM
Quote:quote:Originally posted by Beki
I feel that SMR/HER are a vital resource. I think that in an ideal works more money should be put in to maintaining them
Four questions:
1. Does anyone know what progress is being made in making HERs a statutory obligation on planning authorities?. I seem to remember speculation to this end last year or the year before...
2. I also recall (was it an English Heritage initiative) some talk of the listed building/SAM lists being combined in some form of HER. Is that happening? (or excuse my ignorance Has it happened?)Is the new combined register to be administered by central or local government?
3. Could historic documents/maps form part of an HER. It seems to me that the holistic approach to the historic environment should also include relevant local documentary evidence. Are any HERs going about integrating documentary evidence?
4. Does anyone know whether there is any likelihood of research work being generated as a result of the change from SMR to HER that might interest the wider archaeological community? (me in particular!!)
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22nd November 2005, 12:02 PM
Oi Beki, don't let my dreadful secret out! I didn't think you knew about that anyway.... my little Wonder Woman figure is standing on my sill watching me as I type..... I suppose it's not much worse than being called Luggage Dave!
Totally agree about SMR's and that they should be funded properly - and made statutory. I suspect they could be simplified, or rather drawn together a bit better to sort out the multiple entry problem. I have no experience of the Irish system but I gather that it's a bit more streamlined, anyone know?
The Bradford CRM module, which compulsory, is ok as far is it goes but IMHO a single 3rd year module (ie half a year, 12x2hr lectures) is too little too late. For example you get one lecture on PPG16 and the planning process. I'd like to see CRM/professional Practice run coninuously through all three years, preferably with visiting lecturers from the contact world, curators, museums, etc.
We owe the dead nothing but the truth.
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22nd November 2005, 02:16 PM
Dead right Mr Invisible.
University courses need to include much more on CRM, and I would see that being done in the context of teaching about career options in archaeology. Too many people still graduate with lots of knowledge about archaeology but very little idea either how to do it, or what types of career are open to them.
More vocational training in degrees - an old hobby horse of mine...
1man1desk
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22nd November 2005, 03:10 PM
Quote:quote:Originally posted by kevin wooldridge
Quote:quote:Originally posted by Beki
I feel that SMR/HER are a vital resource. I think that in an ideal works more money should be put in to maintaining them
Four questions:
1. Does anyone know what progress is being made in making HERs a statutory obligation on planning authorities?. I seem to remember speculation to this end last year or the year before...
Pass. I should know but don't as it won't really affect me.
Quote:quote:
2. I also recall (was it an English Heritage initiative) some talk of the listed building/SAM lists being combined in some form of HER. Is that happening? (or excuse my ignorance Has it happened?)Is the new combined register to be administered by central or local government?
I think you are refering to the Heritage Gateway which will be an online "version" of the nmr, listed buildings, SMs, and selected data from the HERs. It's still in a consultation phase and I'm not completely convinced by it.
Quote:quote:
3. Could historic documents/maps form part of an HER. It seems to me that the holistic approach to the historic environment should also include relevant local documentary evidence. Are any HERs going about integrating documentary evidence?
I do! or at least I have a fair amount of info taken from maps and other documentary sources. I think most of the HERs will have as well, at least up until the OS first edition.
Quote:quote:
4. Does anyone know whether there is any likelihood of research work being generated as a result of the change from SMR to HER that might interest the wider archaeological community? (me in particular!!)
I missed out on the extra bits a HER is meant to do compared to a SMR, but if I remember rightly it's mostly suggested research directions rather than compulsory stuff.
My uni did do a CRM module but it wasn't anywhere near adequate in my mind.
I run a small SMR/HER but it is fairly upto date and I spend most of my time inputting the old paper files onto HBSMR (the programme most of us use) and adding new records. I will at some point do a new topic on what it contains, and hopefully get some other HER officers to list theirs so we can compare (we do anyway but it's rare to get it all written down).
excuse the rambling 
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22nd November 2005, 03:19 PM
There is a Heritage Protection Review, or something similar happening at the minute, which, I believe will lead to an integrated Historic Environment Record that includes all listed buildings, and the SMR, and various other bits and pieces, supposedly maintained by local authorities, but with one huge national database somewhere in the darkest recesses of the country... lots of nice data input for us new graduates if it happens...yippee [xx(] Don't hold me to it though!!
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22nd November 2005, 05:54 PM
Quote:quote:Originally posted by rachstebbs
There is a Heritage Protection Review, or something similar happening at the minute, which, I believe will lead to an integrated Historic Environment Record that includes all listed buildings, and the SMR, and various other bits and pieces, supposedly maintained by local authorities, but with one huge national database somewhere in the darkest recesses of the country... lots of nice data input for us new graduates if it happens...yippee [xx(] Don't hold me to it though!!
Oh yeh, forgot about that cos it's going so slowly. Still in consultation stage as far as I know.
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23rd November 2005, 09:24 AM
Quote:quote:Originally posted by rachstebbs
There is a Heritage Protection Review, or something similar happening at the minute, which, I believe will lead to an integrated Historic Environment Record that includes all listed buildings, and the SMR, and various other bits and pieces, supposedly maintained by local authorities, but with one huge national database somewhere in the darkest recesses of the country... lots of nice data input for us new graduates if it happens...yippee [xx(] Don't hold me to it though!!
The Heritage Protection Review is primarily designed to combine listed buildings, scheduled monuments, battlefields and parks and gardens into a single unified statutory list of designated sites, to address the confusion the Government believes exists in the system at the moment, where all these types of sites have differing protection regimes and gradings. HERs/SMRs are a seperate beastie altogether, although one of the long term commitments of the 2004 report "Review of Heritage Protection: - The Way Forward" that concluded the consultation, was that local authorities would be required to maintain or have access to an HER. presumably this "requirement" will ensure statutory status. The report can be downloaded at http://www.culture.gov.uk/global/publica...ection.htm
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23rd November 2005, 01:19 PM
Another point worth emphasising is that even if HERs/SMRs acquire statutory status, that will not imply statutory protection for the sites listed in them (unless they are, separately, listed buildings/SAMS/etc).
1man1desk
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23rd November 2005, 01:56 PM
Quote:quote:Originally posted by Curator Kid
The Heritage Protection Review is primarily designed to combine listed buildings, scheduled monuments, battlefields and parks and gardens into a single unified statutory list of designated sites, to address the confusion the Government believes exists in the system at the moment, where all these types of sites have differing protection regimes and gradings. HERs/SMRs are a seperate beastie altogether..
I recognise that there are differences in 'protected' sites and 'site records' but I would have thought that there must be economies of scale to me nade, if the proposed Heritage Protection Register and the HER were one and the same 'beastie'....
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