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31st January 2007, 08:31 PM
Quote:quote:Some people now seem to be moaning that subs should also cover the cost of their travel around the country.
Perhaps I should have said that subs DO cover your travel costs. I don't think that anyone needs to spend £60 a week on groceries. The rest can be spent on getting you home for the weekend once in a while. Subs are intended to cover the out-of-pocket expenses of being away from home, after all.
When I worked for a big southern unit we had £60 subs and four night accommodation. I had to spend plenty of money on the train every weekend. Without the subs, I would have been barely breaking even.
I certainly didn't mean to come off as ungrateful, I was just pointing out the the presence or absence of subs does a lot to attract or repel people from jobs.
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31st January 2007, 08:41 PM
I think thats the point.... are you better or worse off ... are you out of pocket by living away (after all it is part of the job)
If you must pay out of your pocket to be on a site.. then thats not as good as having your expenses paid.... So don't apologise Oxbeast .. the truth is complex. And has to be discussed.
"No job worth doing was ever done on time or under budget.."
Khufu
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31st January 2007, 10:23 PM
I worked for a pipeline company and didnt recieve any subsistance money....had free accomadation and no bills and being that I was saving on bills, it was winter and so saved loads of money, shopping wasnt to bad as ii meant I had a loaded cupboarded when I got home full of basic stuff. Only down side was the long day.
On the other had when I was recieving subsistance on another job and staying in a B&B actually cost me more as I had to get lunch and dinner from outside.
May god go with you in all the dark places you must walk.
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1st February 2007, 01:42 PM
Quote:quote:and what about when those demanding subsistence don't actually have another residence, ie their free accomm is their only dwelling - how do people feel about that? surely they should not get overnight payments like this, which are designed for those living away from home?
I wouldn't fancy being the manager who's job it is to check if people are still living with their parents![:I]
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1st February 2007, 01:54 PM
I think certain people are missing the point! If as an industry we are trying to present ourselves as proffesionals then perhaps its time we started to ask for the same benifits other proffesionals have. Its not nessessarily the point as to whether or not is more expensive to live away from home (which it obviously is) but rather the subsistance provides a form of compensation for being away from home. We have lives and families elsewhere but have to travel where theres work which is a huge wrench. I dont think its unreasonable to expect this to be made worth my while, and using the subs to get home to see family on the weekend is also something the building industry doesnt have to put up with - they get that paid too...
I for one am fed up with people taking the piss about wages and telling me so and so whos 18 gets this and how much they get overnight etc. Maybe sometime it would be nice to be something other than a building site joke!!
And as for the argument thats how it is, we've never had it so good and all that junk its just a cop out for excepting the situation and thats never going to change anything.
PS miss you lot to smaze :face-stir:
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1st February 2007, 03:02 PM
out of interest then, trowelfodder (but also thrown open to everyone) what do you think an appropriate level of compensation would be for living away from home?
If the pipeline job gives staff another £50 a week, on top of a take home wage of say £200-250, what would you see as a fair percentage of the weekly wage for the subs to be? 20% extra? 50%? a doubling of pay via subs as compensation?
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1st February 2007, 03:27 PM
Don't really want to say anything about subsistence....
However, having finally got around to reading the details of the Network Archaeology ad, I notice that they have increased digger and supervisor wages by £12 and £9 per week respectively (compared to the rates they were advertising for the same posts as recently as last October).
As this puts Network into that small (very small) club of UK archaeological contractors who are paying the Outwage suggested 'dignity' wage i.e £300 pw for diggers, £340-£350 pw for supervisors, I think they deserve at least some congratulations....(if only to the extent of gifting them a personal appearance by Cliff Richard on his comeback tour!!).
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1st February 2007, 07:04 PM
A couple of points
payments to cover expenses are just that and anything else is taxable. Subs are certainty not compensation for being away from home or travelling.
Having looked at the subs rate for the building industry is seems to mean covering accommodation and food.
The notion that people should recieve £27 a night for subs when in self catering accommodation is unrealistic. Fifty pounds a week is not bad I would suggest.
Peter
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1st February 2007, 07:30 PM
beat me to it Peter... subs are not a payment to make up being away from your own loo and comfy chair, they are to cover out of pocket expense .. ie accom / eating out etc... Self catering (free) = no need to give subs.
"No job worth doing was ever done on time or under budget.."
Khufu
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1st February 2007, 07:56 PM
exactly, i totally agree - i know people in similar industries who might get a flat £40 a night 'subs' but they have to sort out their own b+b and meals out of that. Plus their subs for this are the same regardless of the season or part of the country they are working in.. tough luck if its peak holiday season in an expensive part of the UK.
We get decent free accomodation provided for us, normally pretty close to site, and subs on top ..even if were in self-catering accom. Despite trowelfodder's assertion that its obviously more expensive to live away, i think from what others have said on here that a lot of us diggers do pretty well out of current rates of subsistence that the units give us.
