Pay and Conditions

[Ken]

I agree and after I've settled down in my new job and actually started to make some money I'm going to apply to join the DF and Prospect. I think the DF could start to be something with teeth in the future, but only if people actually get involved and I intend to try and do that.

[trowelfodder]

Whats the best way of approaching Prospect all members as individuals or do you think ts worth getting a proforma email together:face-huh:

[BAJR Host]

Thats a yes.. if we can wait til the new year I can work with the DF and we can move on this together

lets stop talking and do it!

[oldgirl]

I'll cheer from the sidelines.

Trowelfodder2 and Chiz - good posts!

(I'm in IfA, but DF wouldn't let me join when they set up and certainly the original BAJRFed description didn't fit me either. I wasn't allowed to stay in Prospect - then IPMS [I was a rep for quite a few years] - when I set up a company. Not that I feel unwanted.)

[BAJR Host]

I think the lines (and blurred lines at that) are there, its just that people are trels.

IfA : Standards and Guidance acting as a professional body --- (it often says it is not a union - well it must remember it is not an employers organisation as well)
FAME: representing Employers - not setting standards, but dealing with business
PROSPECT/DF : Representing employees - standing up for rights and pay/conditions
CBA/Arch Scotland : Representing archaeology to teh public, not commercial work
EH/HS/CADW: National policy
ALGAO: dealing with curatorial and planning issues.. how this impacts commercial work and standards.. (plus HER or SMR work)

I could draw a venn diagram... but people must try and stick to their area, with intersections made to ensure everyone is informed and acting accordingly (joined up thinking anyone?)

And BAJR... hmm... BAJR? More the platform, the stage , the box at speakers corner... all welcome... as long as you don't rave (too much)

[Unitof1]

Being a self employed archaeologist is really rubbish. Nobody wants you except for clients and they are made to. One of the problems that I constantly come up against is employing other archaeologists. I kinda feel that all archaeologists should be equal so I feel odd employing anybody. When you are in a hole in the ground you own it, you decide whats what and stick by it, its your responsibility then what you do with it. It seems to me that all a boss would do is stop you doing what you want to do and then they make you do what they want you to do and they make a living out of you. I don?t see how you can call anybody in that situation an archaeologist, more like they are demolition contractors.

[Unitof1]

Maybe its all about advertising. I don?t advertise myself as a self employed archaeologist as that would suggest that non self employed archaeologists exist ie all those working for somebody pretending to do archaeology. I advertise myself as an archaeologist. What I need is an organisation which represents archaeologists and nobody else. Once we have the concept of an archaeologist established then anything that they do is archaeology.

[wickerman]

It appears that many archaeologists are having hard times and this seems to be confined mainly to field staff. It is apparent that any pay cuts MUST BE across the board and especially include management! It is very easy for company heads to sit in offices in the winter and bemoan the fact that fieldwork is costing so much - 'so lets cut field staff wages'. This especially applies to projects which have not been costed properly in the first place. I agree that the competitive tendering process can only be bad for field staff as the throat cutting between companies will always force down pay. Perhaps the only way forward is for field staff from all companies to organise a nationwide strike. I wonder how developers will cope if their multi-million pound pipelines and housing developments can not progress without the planning depts in councils being able to sign off sites??

[Oxbeast]

Well, this has certainly turned into an interesting thread. As a couple of quick points,
@ClareKing, I appreciate its not nice feeling not wanted, but if company directors were eligible to join the DF, then it might just start reflecting the position of senior management. Like the IfA does.
@Wickerman, perhaps, but how long would this strike have to be? Weeks? No job is going to be held up much by a 1 day strike. I would certainly support a strong union negotiating better pay and conditions, but I'm not sure if a strike should be the first plan of action. Perhaps we can find out from the construction union how they did it.

[brazier]

Is there a move afoot to set up a chartered institute/body for archaeology and its affiliated professions, as is the convention for many other professions? I guess it would be problematic, mainly due to actually getting the assent - but also due to public and personal professional indemnity issues, costs of subscribing, and the "critical mass" needed to ensure its success, etc, etc, but would it not be useful for one and all to be represented and representative by charter? Though it is not a panacea for remedying the ills plaguing our pay and conditions, it might make a difference to how others view and deal with the archaeological and affiliated professions - if we intend to rely on certain aspects of the economy to keep us in work for the forseeable future. Often those who contract us have their own chartered institutes/bodies representing them, so why not us to be on an equal footing? And this federation is the place to start the ball rolling, absolutely.