What was Archaeology like in the Past

[Drunky]

i was reading an journal article about an excavation carried out in the 1980's all the work was done by an archaeological trust over two seasons in advance of the building of an industrial park there was one known site in the area which was a Bronze age burial mound.

what i was wondering was who would have paid for for this and what sort of guide lines where to make people pay, i think the local council where funding the development and generally what systems where in place to at lest save/ record archaeology that was being destroyed through development

It was just a random question that came into my head and as i am the second oldest person on site at the grand old age of 33, there is no one to ask

[Dinosaur]

Ah, the Good Old Days when most funding was from Central Government (DoE), excavations were actually planned more than a week in advance and they were targeted to find stuff with some research objectives, rather than stuff usually turning up by surprise in the middle of a semi-lpanned rush-job as it does these days....actually if it was the 1980s it was more probably funded through the MSC and staffed by people from the nearest Job Centre

[monty]

Eeeeeh It were proper grand in them days ...................................bring back the MSC !!!!:face-approve:

[monty]

Three days a week on site and four in the pub.......proper way of doin things........ and t'brass were alright............

[Wax]

Come on some one tell us what the MSC was really like. The tales I have heard have made my hair stand on end. Along with the unemployed were the unemployable. Drink, drugs, and mental health problems did not mix with heavy machinery. I am all for inclusivity in archaeology but with trained supevisors and other support mechanisms in place. The impression I get is though the MSC brought many people into archaeology it also did a lot of damage ie no budget to write things up properly and the majority of the work force not caring about the job.
I also know people who worked for years as trainees to then be replaced by another trainee rather than be allowed to take up the post that was obviously needed.
Prior to PPG 15 and 16 PPs 5, current employment law and health and safety was it really a better world in archaeology ?}

[Kel]

If claimants are going to have to work for benefits again, we could well be treated to "Son of MSC". Why pay commercial rates for moving mud when you can hire a minimal number of professionals to manage the site and get the rest done for free? That'll count as "giving local people a stake in their heritage" (along with a mattock and a pickaxe) surely? Two birds with one stone. Big Society. Hooray.

[Oxbeast]

I once read an obituary in a well known archaeology magazine of a woman who had achieved wonders in a big historic town, just managing endless teams of prisoners on day release, volunteers, and the long term unemployed on forced labour schemes. The tone of the piece was how much more honourable and excellent this was than using professionals within the planning system.

I was reminded of how Scott's sponsors thought that manhauling sledges was a far more noble and inspiring form of polar travel than 'cheating' by using dogs and skis....

Drunky, be glad that you have seen something written about the site. Most of them disappeared without trace, from what I've heard.

[PeterM]

MSC - variable, depending on when - there were various types of government job creation scheme. A lot of my contemporaries got into museums through 6 month MSC funded placements after graduating, others spent several years supervising (entry for a lot of graduates in the late 70's early 80s was through supervising on schemes). Workers varied from bright, interested and keen to illiterate thugs who were only there to get their benefits. Standard of work varied, depending on staff and how much experience suprevisors had (most graduates with me had months of experience on graduating, having spent two ro three months each summer for four years digging on the big research excavations - Wroxeter, West Heslerton, Wharram Percy, Crickley etc as well as theri own university excavations. The money wasn't great - five grand a year when I started (compared to 16k when an acquaintance of mine was looking for a starter job in dentistry) but a lot better than circuit subsistance of 35 per week or thereabouts. Biggest problem, as far as I could gather, was that it was for immediate reduction of jobless numbers, with no post ex budget, no budget for research, limited for consumables and equipment (so if one of your site cameras got dropped you were a bit stuck for a replacement unless the director was prepared to do some fiddling of figures - and rumour had it that one unit director was cought and prosecuted for doing this very thing).

Oxbeast, I agree absolutely with the Scott thing - Amunsden did the job and survived becasue he was prepared to use the expertise and equipment of the professional arctic inhabitant (and to sacrifice dogs as food for other sledge teams as their sledge load was used up) - success at limited cost (unless you were a dog!) rather than cock up and ultimate grand failure by the use of amateurs with notions of "sportsmanship".

[Dinosaur]

MSC was great for those of us who were already experienced diggers/supervisors and prepared to make the mental adjustment and stop living in tents for half the year and working in McDonalds the other half - finally you could be employed on site year-round and earn a decent(ish) steady wage (in comparison to 'subsistence' etc).

In actual fact quite a lot of 1980s MSC projects are gradually seeing the light of day (or did long-since), two big schemes I can think of off the top of my head (probably cos I spent a year on each) are the monographs on Raunds and Worcester Deansway (or whatever it was finally called, kept changing it's name even during the dig). Much of the archaeology was actually done to a bl***y good standard, although I'll happily concede some wasn't! The 'quality' parts of the Castleford mongraphs are actually mostly the work done under MSC, for instance. If the government want a good job creation scheme, writing the rest up would be a good start....

[monty]

yeah man the drink and drugs.far out ! and all that is told is probably true...I was there and saw the lot.The inclusion of people suffering with their mental health was also very positive and totally laudable, this should still be the case where possible as the benefits to sufferers are manifold. The site I was digging was recorded very well and subsequently published as an excellent monograph. Many got into archaeology through this back door and are still employed in the profession (myself included). In my opinion bring on Son of MSC forthwith !!!
ps when did anyone ever go digging for the money ??