Grand Designs

[BAJR Host]

I do enjoy a good show... and Grand Designs tried and tested format appeals to me, but last night (28th Feb)I watched a programme about the rebuilding of a 14th century Castle in Yorkshire only to watch much sneering about archaeology...

Imagine that.. if you take on a Scheduled Ancient Monument.. you have to do archaeology... imagine that... you have to pay people to do it. I feel the programme made it seem that somehow archaeology was a waste of time, a vast expense (or half a set of stairs!) and a block on development. Far from it...

If you have an archaeology issue... deal with it at the start.. then it is not a problem.. be pleased that highly trained professionals are able to add to the real value of the site, by giving it a history...

You can't on one hand decry archaeology because it was so expensive and was a pain and possibly the whole reason why the development nearly failed.. and then go... ooooooooohh aaaaaaahhh look at the wonderful old building which we now understand thanks to archaeology...


English Heritage will not be able to respond.. but I can make serious guesses that for the work that took place on that building.. there was a lot more help than you saw. there was a lot more to it.

The two points that were valid..

1 We have to reassess how we manage our Built Heritage.. I thought the roof terrace was great and has at last stopped the pickled in aspic attitude... Buildings evolve!
2. The couple were brave and determined.. and I think they deserve the house they created.. the castle deserved the attention.. and the need for more skilled craftsmen like the masons is needed.

English Heritage were breaking new ground here.. so good on them... and please please Kevin ... archaeology is not a bar on development but a necessary part of the whole process if you are dealing with such a fragile and unique resource. Statements like those made in the programme are just the sort to play into the hands of those who would rather sweep our heritage away and replace it with cheap housing.. without any need to preserve or understand our past..


"No job worth doing was ever done on time or under budget.."
Khufu

[Curator Kid]

I couldn't agree more Mr. Hosty.

I thought there was a great opportunity here to explain the importance of archaeological work and put into a meaningful context in relation to regeneration and reuse of historic structures. How else would the architect have been able to properly design and reconstruct some of those fancy features, if archaeologists and buildings historians and English Heritage hadn't been working for years to record and understand the historic examples. Instead all we got was "...that £20,000 archaeological budget would have come in very handy" as if this was money wasted. Appalling

[AchingTrenchHeadAtADesk]

Irresponsible broadcasting.
Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells

[Gog]

Very unfair the way the EH inspector was portrayed as being a problem when in fact he was very much the solution.

And how can anyone who claims to have been a castle fanatic since childhood even contemplate slagging off archaeology?

What is it about architects and their egos that they cannot resist trying to 'improve' a historic building with their own often pisspoor ideas rather than just letting the building be the star?

Having said that, credit to him for rescuing the building in what looked like a very sympathetic manner (no mezzanines or glass atriums). Imagine the disaster if some of our trendy 'celebrity' architects had got hold of it.

[Gizmo]

Completely agree with Mr Hoasty!
I love grand designs, it is one of my favourite programmes! (mainly because I dream that one day I will do the same!)

I thought that the couple were brave to take on such a project and the end result was fantastic (and probably worth a lot more than they spent on it!) and that EH were actually very helpful and accommodating. That roof was a first and as you said, buildings evolve, but it was still a big step for EH to take, and yet they took it. More credit to them I say.

But when it comes to the archaeology I think they came off lightly! Just imagine what could have been in those trenches and what the post-ex costs could have been. And the £20,000 cost of the archaeology…………a mere fraction of the overall budget and they were restoring a SCHEDULED ACIENT MONNUMRNT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Really if they did not think that there would be some archaeological costs then they were living in a dream world!

Although the main reason for the rant is pure jealously! Can you imagine sitting on that terrace with a nice cold beer after work and looking at that view……....................................

[Beardstroker]

Didn't see this one, but if memory serves this isn't the only time that archaeology has been presented as a potential "problem" that has to be overcome in one of these makeover type programme's

I remember one where a couple were renovating an old watermill and were panicking because the local planning archaeologist had put a watching brief condition on it. There was a distinct air impatience with the "wretched beaurucrats" combined with "phew, thank God they never found anything important" about it, which was rather discomfiting. Seems the message about what archaeologists actually do, still isn't getting across to certain TV programme makers.

[troll]

Hmmm...
Nice build, good overall design.Seems to me that EH could have done something with the building themselves but nope-they allowed it to crumble. Have to say that if short bald architect-type blokey had bothered to plan well in advance-he would have halved his problems.Waltzing into a project of that complexity armed with just a set of plans is asking for trouble.On the archaeology front-I thought it was arrogant of the programme to portray us as the bad guys.He may own the land but he has a duty to the heritage aspect of the site. As an aside, would someone be kind enough to point out (to the lady archaeologist) that when machine watching-a hi-viz is a prerequisite-particularly on the telly! I think the stars of the programme were the stonemasons-astonishing job! Overall, waving 400 grand about and then moaning about duties to national heritage issues and having to pay an archaeologist induced puke on my part but...a stunning rebuild.Put EH to shame really.

..knowledge without action is insanity and action without knowledge is vanity..(imam ghazali,ayyuhal-walad)

[BAJR Host]

Have started ranting on Channel 4s Homes Forum as well !!

stop me!

http://community.channel4.com/eve/forums...5910017747

"No job worth doing was ever done on time or under budget.."
Khufu

[troll]

Allow yourself to flow sire-get it out of your system, tiz healthy!

..knowledge without action is insanity and action without knowledge is vanity..(imam ghazali,ayyuhal-walad)

[beamo]

Maybe this indicates that there is a potential need for some form of cross-funding on schemes such as this one, which has led to the retention and reuse of a Scheduled Monument, rather than letting some deluded/inspired family put their entire financial future on the line. OK - so now they have a nice house etc, but it could easily have gone horribly wrong.

Was I right in thinking that at the end of the job the castle had been de-scheduled but remained listed ?

I though that EH did very well in the circumstances, especially in allowing the roof terrace. It was a bit unfair to portray them as having been dragged kicking and screaming into the concept of restoration as opposed to fossilisation, as EH themselves have been advocating this approach for some time now.

Of course on the matter of H & S, how did the stonemasons think that they could prop up the inner wall of two planks and a couple of accros - makes archaeologists look postively virtuous.


Beamo